Come on, bitches, open up your pie-hole and let’s see you ****TRY**** to explain this one away.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-gangs4jul04,0,7027293.story?coll=la-home-headlines

“Hell yeah I support “amnesty,” why don’t you?”

Gee “Gideon,” I don’t know where us Pro-American folk got that damn “A” word from. Gee. It just suddenly injected itself into the argument. Hmmm.

;^)

Try again, please? And challenge me this time around, give me an argument that doesn’t take more than ten seconds to counter, I would appreciate the “puzzle.”

Kudos for an original response.

I have to give you that much ;p

Read this.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060620/ap_on_re_us/illegal_immigrants_crackdown_4

And it is ***NOT*** part of Mexico ***NOW***, is it?

If “first owner” has the right then the first owners are the Native Americans of this country, not to a bunch of cowards too scared to fight for rights in their own country.

America is ***OUR*** nation, ***WE*** make the laws and if we think our neighbors are a bunch of self serving assholes who hate us, then we can certainly roll up the welcome mat (not that we ever had one out for them) and tell them to handle their own business and stay off our doorstep, at gun point.

I also think that the social services drain argument is one-sided at best.
-Kevin

Sure. Their side does all the taking and does ***VERY LITTLE*** paying into it.

It ignores the fact that truly massive amounts of taxes get paid directly into both state and federal coffers by illegals via payroll taxes

Someone (that would be you, Kevin) is trying entirely too hard to bullshit. Illegals aren’t on payrolls, they’re usually in the agribusiness and are paid out of pocket. At best they pay sales tax. And furthermore…

and local taxes get paid by them indirectly via the rent they pay. Only a complete moron of a real estate owner would not pass on property taxes costs to tenants, for example.

And only a “complete moron” would argue that a RE owner hiking the rent equals dutifully paying the taxes. Well to be more accurate, it could be more than a “complete moron” advocating that, but also a paid by the Mexican government PR whore. Those of us watching the news do know that the Vicente’s government has been paying for “scientific studies” and many phony little advocacy groups that are popping up all over the place. You could easily be one of Vicente’s putas, but so far you’re not coming across like one. So we’ll stick to “complete moron” until you prove capable of examining the fact that you’re totally sucking up Mexican consulate talking points and repeating them.

There aren’t a lot of people (liberal or conservative) in favor of any “pathway to citizenship” for people here illegally, period. You don’t like for it to be called amnesty, we get it. But you can wave your hands and stomp your feet all you like and it is still putting people who are here illegally ahead of people who have respected our laws in the path to citizenship.

People agree on tighter border security and stronger enforcement against companies — but agreement doesn’t motivate as much posting, so everyone will continue to post responses to your slow-motion-amnesty proposal because the vast majority of Americans don’t support it
-Nathanial

Good going Nate, this cuts to the quick here. Just because they don’t call it amnesty doesn’t mean it ceases to be so.

And those of you using the “A-word” (amnesty) here and elsewhere are shooting their anti-immigration cause in the foot.
-Gideon

Not at all, A is A. Something is what it is no matter what it is called. A pardon and an offer of citizenship, even if terse, is still the same thing, in particular since the plan takes the illegal’s word on when they came in. At least the last plan that was on deck anyway.

You folks who are “Amnesty” opponents on are more than likely responsible for the impending massive influx of illegals.
-Gideon

No, we’ll be responsible for the massive OUTflux of illegals ;^)

The GOP raised this issue to energize its racist base and get those voters to vote for the GOP this November. The Republicans who raised it had no intention of ACTUALLY doing something about the problem, because A) It would piss-off businessmen who use undocumented workers and B)
-Gideon

I will grant you that it is one of the periodic GOP “cattle calls” but this time it has hit a “positive” nerve across the country, not just Republicans and many people (MILLIONS!) who don’t have a trace of racism in them, including many black Americans who are sick of the attitude problems coming out of the illegal community. Some of those illegals are more disrespectful of black Americans than white Americans, which is pretty stupid for someone that doesn’t have a green card, much less citizenship.

America doesn’t have the resources to jettison 12 million people.
-Gideon

Wrong. We do. It’s a simple process, really, and it’s already begun. Just as America should, cities and states across the Union are starting the process already. It starts with cities and states using existing laws or making new, tighter laws requiring proof of citizenship or residency status for medical benefits, insurance, licenses and jobs. Then by enforcing them, arresting them, and kicking them out first thing. Enforcing huge fines and prison time for employers who refuse to comply also helps. In parts of the country, such as San Diego, illegals are actually starting to go home due to lack of jobs. Not only because of our shitty economy, but also because local San Diegans don’t eat at restaurants where Pepe Illegalcano is serving up food with the hand he just wiped his grungy nose with. Once out of jobs, illegals will continue to go home on their own, they don’t have the nuts to take up arms against us. And if they are stupid enough to do so… they’ll get hurt, enough said. They tried to go there somewhat during the Pro-Mexico rallies a few weeks back but it fell apart quickly.

By then, it will (hopefully) be the Democrats’ turn to create a solution, and I hope they look at some of Greg’s suggestions.
-Gideon

Nope. The Dems are going to come around and kick Pepe Illegalcano and his buddies back where they came from. You can see that call coming up from the grass roots of the Democratic party if you look. By all means, please do look, start with Democratic Underground.

The GOP raised this issue to energize its racist base and get those voters to vote for the GOP this November. The Republicans who raised it had no intention of ACTUALLY doing something about the problem, because A) It would piss-off businessmen who use undocumented workers and B) America doesn’t have the resources to jettison 12 million people.

When the plan backfired, McCain and Kennedy proposed legislation that would require undocumented residents to turn themselves in, pay back taxes for the years they’ve been here illegally, stay current with their taxes, spend a lot of money to learn English, and then — after ten to twelve years — go to the back of the legal immigration line and apply for citizenship.

That is not “amnesty.” Calling such a plan “amnesty” was a cheap, lazy, and dishonest way to kill it. Further, I believe that doing so exacerbated the very problem immigration critics claimed they wanted solved.

The only uspide to this mess is that the GOP has not only alienated Hispanics, but the members of their base who got their hopes up and now feel betrayed because the GOP has backed away from doing anything for at least a year.

By then, it will (hopefully) be the Democrats’ turn to create a solution, and I hope they look at some of Greg’s suggestions.

And of course, anyone questioning the Iraq War is aiding the enemy by showing them weakness in our resolve, right? We would all just be much better off if we’d keep quiet and never draw attention to problems, because that just makes people want to take advantage of the problems.